Veritas-bu

Re: [Veritas-bu] Top 20 (or so) misunderstood things about NBU

2008-04-10 11:11:37
Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] Top 20 (or so) misunderstood things about NBU
From: "WEAVER, Simon \(external\)" <simon.weaver AT astrium.eads DOT net>
To: "Stuart Liddle" <stuart.liddle AT glasshouse DOT com>, <VERITAS-BU AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2008 15:42:58 +0100
Stuart
Not at all. In fact I thought I was replying to Steve's post earlier today. Must have pressed the REPLY to the wrong Email :-)
 
Just sometimes these threads get too big and it was probably overlooked. dont worry about it ok ?? I think the point I was making that the guy that got shot (fired) was SHOT (fired) for all the wrong reasons!! Even when he tried to advise them (the company) of this status 1 SQL problem.
 
So yes, I agree with everything you said, including the DB related stuff :)
 
Simon
P.S. not everyones posts come in at the same time (sometimes there are delays of 4 hours or so). But chill ok :) My comments too were based on Status 1, and from a quote that Steve stated in an earlier post saying "I think it all depends upon what you want to achieve.  I personally don’t have a problem with seeing status code 1’s and ignoring them, but some people don’t like to see them which is why I suggested the exclude lists."


From: Stuart Liddle [mailto:stuart.liddle AT glasshouse DOT com]
Sent: Thursday, April 10, 2008 3:32 PM
To: WEAVER, Simon (external); VERITAS-BU AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu
Subject: RE: [Veritas-bu] Top 20 (or so) misunderstood things about NBU

Simon,

 

Are you deliberately trying to misunderstand what I am saying?  I stated in a previous post that databases are a special case when it comes to a status 1.  There are ways to backup SQL databases without having to get the NBU agent. 

 

I also stated in a previous post that you should investigate a status 1 the first time you back up a client and go over the results with the application owner.  You can use that information to set up exclude lists and show the application & system owner how this is done and let them manage it.  Once you have done that, you have done your due diligence and it’s time to move on.

 

The best thing that any backup team can do is to put in place a clear charter of their service offerings and include a delineation of responsibilities.  The backup team cannot be held responsible for the system administrators forgetting to ask to have a new system added to backups.  The backup team cannot be held responsible for backing up a database that they don’t have knowledge of.

 

Again, databases are a special case in the backup world.  My position is that when you get a request to backup a database server you work with the DBA’s and get their backup requirements and then schedule a restore test.  It is the responsibility of the DBA’s to ensure that their databases are getting backed correctly up AND that they can be restored correctly.  But, they have to work with the backup team to get it done.  The backup team should NOT have to work in a vacuum and guess as to what the client wants.

 

We required that when someone wanted to add a new system or database to the backups, that a request get submitted.  We did not add new systems or databases unless we got that request.  Everyone knew this and they had no recourse if it turned out their system crashed and they had forgotten to have it added to backups.  The responsibility was placed firmly where it belonged….on the system owner.

 

Finally, the backup team should provide reports to their customers (managers, system owners, application owners, DBA’s) using something like Bocada to provide daily backup status.  If you provide them with that information (including systems that get status code 1), they will be able to review and determine on an on-going basis if they have a problem or not.

 

This is all basic stuff, if you don’t have this in place, then you are asking for trouble.  I was basing my comments on status 1’s on the above being in place….YMMV.

 

-stuart
1.  People think that you're working on a backup system.   You're not - you're working on a *recovery* system.  If you can't recover, backups are useless.

2.  File system backups are not a replacement for bare metal restore.  It is usually not acceptable to just do a fresh install, restore files, and expect to be back to where they're started

3.  Error messages really are important.  Check them every day or you'll eventually discover that failures were missed in the noise and backups haven't run in a long time.  When you do a restore is not the time to check to see if backups actually ran.

4.  Audits are important.  The larger the environment, the more likely it is that file systems are missed.  This is especially true of clusters.  Sometimes it's not the failures that get you but the lack of attempts.

5.  Backing up clusters by physical host names will cause you grief.

6.  Application owners are responsible for ensuring the application is recoverable.  A backup admin, working in a vacuum, can not help you.


7.  Test your restores regularly.

There are lots more but this is a start...

--
Ed Wilts, Mounds View, MN, USA
mailto:ewilts AT ewilts DOT org

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