Veritas-bu

Re: [Veritas-bu] Question for NetBackup 7.0 Dedup userORData Domain users

2010-08-25 11:34:49
Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] Question for NetBackup 7.0 Dedup userORData Domain users
From: "Martin, Jonathan" <JMARTI05 AT intersil DOT com>
To: "Mark Glazerman" <Mark.Glazerman AT spartech DOT com>, "stefanos" <smpt1 AT peppas DOT gr>, "Travis Kelley" <rhatguy AT gmail DOT com>, <judy_hinchcliffe AT administaff DOT com>, <CAlley AT kforce DOT com>, <veritas-bu AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu>
Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2010 11:34:37 -0400
I've just recently had a meeting with my Symantec rep, and we were led to 
believe that license cost and replication were NetBackup advantages. For 
example, I was under the impression that if you backed up 10TB of data weekly, 
but kept 100 deduped copies on 40TB of storage, that you only needed 10TB of 
license. Also, we were told NetBackup dedupe maintains replication to an 
offsite media server, and that you don't have to pay for that 40TB of storage 
either.  Is this not the case? We haven't talked to Data Domain yet, but that 
licensing model looks like a serious advantage to Exagrid's $6,000 / TB.

-Jonathan

-----Original Message-----
From: veritas-bu-bounces AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu 
[mailto:veritas-bu-bounces AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu] On Behalf Of Mark 
Glazerman
Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2010 11:22 AM
To: stefanos; Travis Kelley; judy_hinchcliffe AT administaff DOT com; CAlley AT 
kforce DOT com; veritas-bu AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu
Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] Question for NetBackup 7.0 Dedup userORData Domain 
users

Using the ddboost ost plugin from Data Domain in conjunction with Netbackup 
moves the metabase comparisons from the data domain appliance to the media 
server.  This dramatically reduces the amount of backup traffic being sent to 
the data domain and speeds up the backups considerably.

We looked at NBU 7's built in dedupe and saw ok numbers on small file, OS type 
backup data but for applications like exchange where we currently store around 
40 full copies in 1.8TB of space on our data domains, we couldn't get 4 copies 
in the same amount of space using netbackup's dedupe.  The fixed block dedupe 
algorithm of netbackups built in dedupe cannot handle large files as well as 
the variable block compression algorithms of the data domain.

Also.. from a licensing point of view we worked out it was essentially $1000 
per TB to license dedupe in Netbackup (Enterprise disk option and dedupe is 
licensed per TB).  This is something you have to factor in, especially if you 
have a large environment. Replication of this backed up data is something else 
you'd need to devise a solution for.  With data Domain,  the replication part 
is easy. 

Mark Glazerman
Desk: 314-889-8282
Cell: 618-520-3401
 please don't print this e-mail unless you really need to

-----Original Message-----
From: veritas-bu-bounces AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu 
[mailto:veritas-bu-bounces AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu] On Behalf Of stefanos
Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2010 3:02 AM
To: 'Travis Kelley'; judy_hinchcliffe AT administaff DOT com; CAlley AT kforce 
DOT com; veritas-bu AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu
Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] Question for NetBackup 7.0 Dedup user ORData Domain 
users

The big difference between DataDomain (and all appliances) and nebackup
deduplication option is that netbackup can do the process on the client.
This will speed up the time of the backup.
With DD and netbackup media server deduplication, nothing will change at
your backup time, as all your data will travel to the media server.

Do not listen to the companies about the deduplication ratio. Your data is
unique, and nobody can predict the ratio. 
Ask for a demo from both companies. 

-----Original Message-----
From: veritas-bu-bounces AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu
[mailto:veritas-bu-bounces AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu] On Behalf Of Travis
Kelley
Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2010 12:38 AM
To: judy_hinchcliffe AT administaff DOT com; CAlley AT kforce DOT com;
veritas-bu AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu
Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] Question for NetBackup 7.0 Dedup user OR Data
Domain users

Data domain also has a limit to the amount of data one of their units
can track but its fairly high.  If you need more than 32TB of deduped
data in PD you do need to deploy a seperate puredisk environment. Then
PD just splits the hash space into chunks and stores data on whichever
node it hases to.  I'm not sure what their upper limit is but it can
scale quite high also.

On 8/24/10, judy_hinchcliffe AT administaff DOT com
<judy_hinchcliffe AT administaff DOT com> wrote:
> Remember that the built in de-dup as a limit on the amount of data it can
> keep track of.
> Over that amount you need to use a de-dup appliance.
>
>
> From: veritas-bu-bounces AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu
> [mailto:veritas-bu-bounces AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu] On Behalf Of Alley,
Chris
> Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2010 4:09 PM
> To: veritas-bu AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu
> Subject: [Veritas-bu] Question for NetBackup 7.0 Dedup user OR Data Domain
> users
>
> We are looking to change our backups to a disk based deduplication
solution,
> and 2 of our options are to utilize NetBackup 7.0's built in dedupe
(Client
> and Media server) or to put a Data Domain box in.  I wanted to see if I
> could get some real world feedback on what you guys have been seeing in
> terms of dedupe rates, performance, etc.  For example Data Domain claims
we
> would only see about 5:1 dedupe rate using NetBackup, which seems quite a
> bit lower than what I would expect....and of course they claim they would
> get about 20:1.  I realize that all data is different, which is why I have
> hopes that several people will reply with what they are seeing.  Thanks
for
> your time!
>
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