Veritas-bu

[Veritas-bu] NDMP Restores

2001-06-28 09:04:12
Subject: [Veritas-bu] NDMP Restores
From: David A. Chapa" <david AT xbpadm-commands DOT com (David A. Chapa)
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 06:04:12 -0700 (PDT)
Yup, I fully agree.

Quoting "W. Curtis Preston" <curtis AT backupcentral DOT com>:

> Grant,
>
> Thanks for the information.  I'd like to comment on a 
few things.  First,
> let me say that I am a fan of NDMP, as it is giving 
us a valid solution for
>
> backing up all these NetApps I keep seeing 
everywhere. ;)  Before valid
> NDMP server and client software was in place, all we 
had was NFS.  I have a
>
> lot of respect for NetApp and the other backup and 
recovery options you
> have (Snapshots, SnapMirror, etc.), but I would like 
this one issue
> addressed.
>
> At 11:45 AM 6/27/2001 -0700, Melvin, Grant wrote:
> >         NetApp's dump is no stranger to this, we 
have added support
> >         for qtree metadata, NT ACLs, Unicode, NT 
Streams. However, a
> >         standard BSD restore compatible application 
such as Solaris'
> >         ufsrestore can still restore the data, but 
will only restore
> >         NFS attributes. So should you have zero 
filers in 10 years
> >         (heaven forbid) and a pile of NDMP/dump 
tapes to restore from
> >         then as long as you have access to a dump 
compatible restore
> >         program you should be able to manually 
retrieve your data.
>
> The key for the original poster to understand is the 
word _manually_.  This
>
> means that you can load the tape into a Solaris box  
(or any box that can
> read BSD dump, such as HP, AIX, Linux), do some 
manual tape manipulation,
> and be able to restore the data (without the NT-
specific info).  This is a
> far cry from being able to point and click your 
restores into existence.
>
> >         Legato's BudTool product proved that NetApp 
data could be
> >         restored on non-NetApp storage either in a 
disaster recovery
> >         scenario or because that is what the 
customer wants. We'd like
> >         to think that some if not all of the 
current 7 NDMP-compliant
> >         backup software applications that support 
NetApp could add the
> >         same capability.
>
> Yes, they could, and I wish they would.  I wonder if 
some of us should just
>
> write a tool that does that?  Hmmm.. Gears 
churning....
> I wonder if we could figure out a way to feed these 
tapes to AMANDA, and
> have AMANDA automate the restores.
> Or just write our own utility...  Hmm....  Anyone 
interested in this
> project?
>
> >         Marion asks for a standard backup tape 
format that can be
> >         interchanged between NDMP-compliant vendors 
and we applaud
> >         her for it. However, that is beyond the 
current scope of the
> >         NDMP community or the SNIA Backup working 
group in general.
> >
> >         We think its going to take an awful lot of 
persuading to get
> >         all the current backup software vendors to 
define a single
> >         format and then have all the possible 
system vendors support
> >         it. Most companies have chosen their 
solution based on
> >         trying to differentiate themselves from all 
the others and
> >         we see that continuing for some time.
>
> Yes, it would take some doing to accomplish that.  
However, we've got to
> start somewhere.  My biggest issue with NDMP is that 
it allows the OS
> vendor (in this case NetApp) to determine the backup 
format.  I understand
> that it would be a lot of work to get this 
accomplished, but I don't think
> it's outside the realm of possibility.
>
> Trying to differentiate yourself in the backup world 
is a bad thing.  (I
> submit for your perusal IRIX's XFSDUMP.)  I'm glad to 
hear that NetApps
> tapes can at least be read by a dump-knowledgeable 
box.  But you're not the
>
> only vendor out there.
>
> Yes, I know that it says right in the V5 spec that 
backup format is out of
> scope.  Yes, I know that getting a bunch of vendors 
to get together is not
> an easy thing. But I'll keep saying that this should 
be in scope until
> somebody listens:
>
> OS-SPECIFIC BACKUP COMMANDS BAD
>
> I do wish that Veritas would make their multiplexed 
backup format a little
> more open, and make a command that can easily read a 
NetBackup multiplexed
> tape if NetBackup is dead, but at least their backup 
format is the same on
> every box.  The idea of going back to the days when I 
had Solaris, HP,
> and  Ultrix dump tapes, and 3B2 cpio tapes, and VAX 
backup tapes gives me
> chills.  And, given the upcoming prominence of the 
NAS industry, we may
> have just that.  (Assuming you're in a shop that has 
more than one NAS
> vendor.)  That would stink.
>
> Anybody that agree with me, feel free to send a "me 
too" message.
>
>
> ---
> W. Curtis Preston
> Principal Consultant for Storage Designs, your 
storage experts
> Webmaster: http://www.backupcentral.com Phone: 760 
653 1007
>
> _______________________________________________
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bu AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu
> 
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bu
> 



<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
David A. Chapa
Consulting Manager
DataStaff, Inc.
847 413 1144
http://www.consulting.datastaff.com
---------------------------------------
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