Re: [Veritas-bu] Top 20 (or so) misunderstood things about NBU
2008-04-10 02:44:12
Stuart
This is where we differ.... if I was in your boat, I think
my attitude to status 1 would be alot different to yours.
Cover your back is my advice to you.
Simon
I think it all depends
upon what you want to achieve. I personally don’t have a problem with
seeing status code 1’s and ignoring them, but some people don’t like to see them
which is why I suggested the exclude lists. BUT, it must be understood
that the people responsible for those servers are responsible for the exclude
lists that are on them. If admins outside of the backup/restore group know
this, then they are the ones that are responsible for whether or not a file is
getting backed up.
Take that a step
further…yes, you are responsible for recovery. But, if you are NOT told
about a new server being added and given a specific request to back it up (and
what to back up on that server), then how can YOU be responsible for its
recovery? Ultimately, the recovery depends upon what the backup/restore
team is TOLD about by the people who administer the servers & apps….you
can’t read people’s minds.
--stuart
From: Haskins,
Steve [mailto:Steve.Haskins AT bannerhealth DOT com] Sent: Wednesday, April 09, 2008 2:17
PM To: Stuart Liddle; Jeff Lightner;
VERITAS-BU AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu Subject: RE: [Veritas-bu] Top 20 (or so)
misunderstood things about NBU
I agree with
verifying with the application support techs on what files are being skipped and
how to address them as they are responsible for their applications but as the
backup and operating system administrator I am held accountable for recovery. I
don’t like exclude lists especially if it is just to make the reports look good
for status 0. I have found that in too many cases an exclude list in created and
then another administrator or application support tech will make a change and
now important files are being skipped that shouldn’t be. If coordinated
correctly with procedures and documentation this should not be the case but
there is still the reliance upon human intervention to follow procedures and to
document.
Regards
From:
veritas-bu-bounces AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu
[mailto:veritas-bu-bounces AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu] On Behalf Of Stuart Liddle Sent: Wednesday, April 09, 2008 1:40
PM To: Jeff Lightner;
VERITAS-BU AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] Top 20 (or so)
misunderstood things about NBU
Yes….very true.
What I recommend doing is to check all backups against a new client the first
few times and see what is causing the partial success. Checking with the
application support people on what files are OK to skip is always a good idea
and will definitely eliminate problems in the future. Then use this
information to build an exclude list for the
client.
I used to treat
databases as a special case for backups since they are so temperamental. I
would do SQL databases by having the SQL DBA’s do their own backup of the db to
the local filesystem (or a network share). Then we would have the DBA’s
put together an exclude list for their SQL servers to exclude the active DB
files. Then we would schedule our backup jobs for a time AFTER the SQL
local backups. Never had to worry about restoring SQL DB’s after
that. But, testing database restores is very critical to ensuring
that you are backing up the right thing(s). And you definitely need the
assistance of the DBA’s for this.
-stuart
From: Jeff
Lightner [mailto:jlightner AT water DOT com] Sent: Wednesday, April 09, 2008 1:31
PM To: Stuart Liddle; VERITAS-BU AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu Subject: RE: [Veritas-bu] Top 20 (or so)
misunderstood things about NBU
I’d amend point 3 to
say “does NOT ALWAYS mean”.
There are many OS and
filesystem level backups that are complete despite status 1.
However, having a status 1 on a database backup can be a real
killer…
From:
veritas-bu-bounces AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu
[mailto:veritas-bu-bounces AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu] On Behalf Of Stuart Liddle Sent: Wednesday, April 09, 2008 3:52
PM To: VERITAS-BU AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] Top 20 (or so)
misunderstood things about NBU
I think I would agree
with all of what Ed has stated here. However, I think that these points
would apply to ANY backup product and not just NBU.
Since the question was
about the “top 20 (or so) misunderstood things about NBU”, I’d have to add the
following:
1) Yes, there
is a command line interface! The GUI is NOT the only way to do things with
NBU. (yeah, this might be generic,
but…)
2) Multiplexing
and Multistreaming are not the same thing and both need to be tuned properly in
order to optimize your backups.
3) A return
code of “1” on a backup does NOT mean that the backup has failed. Nor does
it mean that the files that could not be backed up are essential to the recovery
of the system. (This DOES mean that the backup admin needs to have a
discussion with the system admins and application support folks about what files
can be safely ignored on backups. Building exclude lists helps.)
I had to explain to a manager once why we treated a return code “1” (partial
success) the same as return code zero (successful). His thought was that
he wanted everything to be zero return code!
4) Yes, NBU
includes reporting, but it is no substitute for a 3rd party reporting
tool like Bocada. (another item that could be about any backup
tool).
I’ll have to think up
some other NBU specific items and add to this list
later.
-stuart
From:
veritas-bu-bounces AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu
[mailto:veritas-bu-bounces AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu] On Behalf Of Ed Wilts Sent: Tuesday, April 01, 2008 8:11
AM To: Curtis
Preston Cc: VERITAS-BU AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] Top 20 (or so)
misunderstood things about NBU
On Mon, Mar 31, 2008 at 4:48 PM, Curtis Preston <cpreston AT glasshouse DOT com>
wrote:
What are the top 5/20/30 things about NBU that you
think people get wrong?
1. People think that you're
working on a backup system. You're not - you're working on a
*recovery* system. If you can't recover, backups are
useless.
2. File system backups are not a replacement for bare
metal restore. It is usually not acceptable to just do a fresh install,
restore files, and expect to be back to where they're started
3.
Error messages really are important. Check them every day or you'll
eventually discover that failures were missed in the noise and backups haven't
run in a long time. When you do a restore is not the time to check to see
if backups actually ran.
4. Audits are important. The larger
the environment, the more likely it is that file systems are missed. This
is especially true of clusters. Sometimes it's not the failures that get
you but the lack of attempts.
5. Backing up clusters by physical
host names will cause you grief.
6. Application owners are responsible for ensuring
the application is recoverable. A backup admin, working in a vacuum, can
not help you.
7. Test your restores
regularly.
There are lots more but this is a start...
-- Ed
Wilts, Mounds View,
MN, USA mailto:ewilts AT ewilts DOT org
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- Re: [Veritas-bu] Top 20 (or so) misunderstood things about NBU, (continued)
Re: [Veritas-bu] Top 20 (or so) misunderstood things about NBU, Ed Wilts
Re: [Veritas-bu] Top 20 (or so) misunderstood things about NBU, WEAVER, Simon (external)
Re: [Veritas-bu] Top 20 (or so) misunderstood things about NBU, WEAVER, Simon (external)
Re: [Veritas-bu] Top 20 (or so) misunderstood things about NBU, Smithers, Mike
Re: [Veritas-bu] Top 20 (or so) misunderstood things about NBU, Rusty . Major
Re: [Veritas-bu] Top 20 (or so) misunderstood things about NBU, Weber, Philip
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