Hi Folks,
I agreed with Curtis, you can do a lot more using CLI NetBackup commands on
UNIX rather then on Windows.
Unfortunately at my present job, the master server is Windows and it was
original built, but lucky enough, I was able to add a few Sun Solaris media
servers to the architecture, and all my stats, calcs, offsite vault and so
on, on the UNIX media servers. Also, the network speed, you cannot beat on
UNIX, tcp/ip stack is still faster and better on Solaris/Linux. I also had
problem with tape driver on Windows and had to get the patch for that limit
for 64k data buffers. And yes, at least a month, I need a reboot for
Windows, not UNIX, I can just do stop/start. So, would be a question, can I
easily migrate the master from Windows to a UNIX/Linux server? Probably not.
Regards,
Boris
On 5/1/07, Curtis Preston <cpreston at glasshouse.com> wrote:
>
> Oops. Sorry about that, Jeff.
>
> I tend to type too quickly when I believe my honor has been challenged.
> ;)
>
> So, to John, then...
>
> After looking at the responses again, perhaps I could have been more
> verbose in my reply to the poster's question, which was one of the
> responses that got your blood boiling. I still believe that the best
> way for him to do what he wants is to install Perl or cygwin on Windows.
> If he wants to continue putting a round peg (shell scripts passed around
> on this list) into a round hole (vbscript), then I wish him the best of
> luck, but I doubt he will get much help on this list.
>
> As to my personal preference for Unix/Linux for master/media servers, I
> point out a recent client of ours. They were forced to reboot their
> Windows master server every 2-3 days, or it would stop working
> completely. They almost wouldn't believe our consultant who told them
> their new Linux master server wouldn't need rebooting at all -- that it
> would be common to leave it running for months or a year at a time with
> no reboots.
>
> In the pro-Windows corner, I'd say Unix is a big pill to swallow for the
> first timer. It's a big pill for me to swallow and I've been doing it
> for 13 years! I'm still lost when wandering around Solaris 10. The
> mainstream platforms also tend to be much more expensive than the
> typical Intel stuff, although that's becoming much less true than
> before. And if you want really cheap, take that box you were going to
> run Windows on and run CentOS, which is a completely free version of
> RedHat Enterprise Linux -- all the good stuff without the cost. (Does
> anybody actually call RHEL support?)
>
> But, seriously, I'd sooner quit than have to do without bpgp, and that's
> what I'd have to do if I switched to Windows NBU master servers. That's
> not because Windows stinks. It's because Veritas didn't think the
> Windows version needed that command.
>
>
> ---
> W. Curtis Preston
> Author of O'Reilly's Backup & Recovery and Using SANs and NAS
> VP Data Protection
> GlassHouse Technologies
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jeff Lightner [mailto:jlightner at water.com]
> Sent: Monday, April 30, 2007 4:51 PM
> To: Curtis Preston; Martin, Jonathan (Contractor);
> veritas-bu at mailman.eng.auburn.edu
> Subject: RE: [Veritas-bu] New technote for Windows NetBackup Masters
>
> Point of information:
>
> It was not I that did the flame - it was Martin, Jonathan.
>
> Perhaps I should have stayed out of it but I couldn't resist responding
> with what I thought was a humorous (ok, some might say, smart@$$) reply.
> :D
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Curtis Preston [mailto:cpreston at glasshouse.com]
> Sent: Monday, April 30, 2007 7:07 PM
> To: Jeff Lightner; Martin, Jonathan (Contractor);
> veritas-bu at mailman.eng.auburn.edu
> Subject: RE: [Veritas-bu] New technote for Windows NetBackup Masters
>
> Wow, Jeff... I didn't see anything aimed at anyone personally until
> your message. I saw my message that says I don't think Windows systems
> should be master or media servers, and I stand by that with one caveat
> (below). I saw a message pointing out a feature that had a very
> negative side effect. Then I saw your flame back to the mean Unix
> people for pointing out this side effect, and it even included a comment
> aimed at me personally.
>
> At the risk of completely wasting my time, I will clarify these two
> messages (only one of which came from me).
>
> 1. Unix master & media servers should be on Unix/Linux
>
> I tell everyone that if they're a mixed Unix/Windows shop, their master
> servers should be on Unix/Linux. And frankly, I believe they should be
> on Linux. If they're an ALL Windows shop, then they should stay on
> Windows. But if they grok Unix, then you can do far more with a
> Unix/Linux media server than you can with a Windows one.
>
> This isn't so much of an indictment against Windows as it is an
> acknowledgment that the predominance of NBU customers use Unix/Linux
> masters, and that most of the tools that come out of this user community
> will be written with an assumption that they will be used on Unix/Linux.
> (The admin that wrote the question, for example, could just use the
> scripts he/she was given.)
>
> If you want to "use what works," then use perl or shell tools. They're
> easily available on this list, they're easily supported by people on
> this list when they have a minor problem, and they really do the job.
> If you can't use them on a Unix/Linux server where they started, then
> you should do what I suggested to him and install Perl on Windows. I
> really doubt he's going to find someone on this list who can help him do
> with vbscript.
>
> And, yes, without going into it here, I see a number of technical
> advantages of Unix/Linux master media media servers over Windows media
> servers. Here's just a few off the top of my head:
>
> * Raw device access for disks and tapes
> * tape library and tape drive manipulation from the command line when
> things are broken in netbackup
> * Process lists that are long, easy to read
> * bpgp -- it's my favorite, unadvertised tool in NetBackup, and it's not
> available in Windows NBU
> * don't have to install security patches every other day and often
> reboot in order to install them
> * don't have to run virus software on my backup server
>
> What advantages do Windows NBU servers have over Unix NBU servers?
> Other than familiarity for an all-Windows shop, I can't think of any.
> How is this disrespect to Windows admins?
>
>
> 2. This "feature" of automatically reinstalling things is a problem
>
> All the person did was send a message that pointed out a feature of
> Windows that could cause your backups to shut down without any notice.
> While I agree that the reinstall of critical files is a nice idea, if it
> causes my backups to shutdown without any notice to me, that's NOT a
> good idea. I can't believe that your post basically defends this
> practice.
>
> I'm sorry you're not going to buy my book. It's actually got a lot of
> really cool tools for Windows folks in there. I explain how to backup
> Exchange, SQL Server, and do bare metal recovery of Windows -- all
> without buying a single commercial backup software product.
>
> ---
> W. Curtis Preston
> Author of O'Reilly's Backup & Recovery and Using SANs and NAS
> VP Data Protection
> GlassHouse Technologies
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: veritas-bu-bounces at mailman.eng.auburn.edu
> [mailto:veritas-bu-bounces at mailman.eng.auburn.edu] On Behalf Of Jeff
> Lightner
> Sent: Monday, April 30, 2007 2:17 PM
> To: Martin, Jonathan (Contractor); veritas-bu at mailman.eng.auburn.edu
> Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] New technote for Windows NetBackup Masters
>
> Everyone knows M$ Windoze causes warts, premature births and halitosis.
>
> :p
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: veritas-bu-bounces at mailman.eng.auburn.edu
> [mailto:veritas-bu-bounces at mailman.eng.auburn.edu] On Behalf Of Martin,
> Jonathan (Contractor)
> Sent: Monday, April 30, 2007 4:59 PM
> To: veritas-bu at mailman.eng.auburn.edu
> Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] New technote for Windows NetBackup Masters
>
> Ok.. I was going to reserve comment but after those two comments bump
> that...
>
> <<<INCOMING SARCASM - FLAME ON>>>
>
> Synopsis of Technote - If you remove any of the critical Netbackup files
> from Drive:\Program Files\Veritas when you run the Admin Gui on the
> Netbackup Server, Windows Installer is (::ghasp / horrified look::)
> going to try and put them back.
>
> I mean, seriously, what is Microsoft thinking trying to put application
> critical executables back into their proper places? What kind of a
> drunken imbecile of an admin wants their applications where they belong?
> And even if we thought this was a good thing, we certainly wouldn't want
> to call it a feature!? And surely Symantec should realize a patch to
> fix this undesirable good idea!
>
> Thank you very much for pointing this out, I appreciate the effort. I
> think its great that you Xnix guys lob whatever bit of windows
> misunderstanding across the fence you can find to potentially hit us on
> the head with. We after all as Windows admins aren't very smart, and
> hitting us in the head with misunderstanding is certainly the best way
> to educate us.
>
> For the record: This is a feature of windows (go delete excel.exe and
> try running excel and you will also find this "issue" present on non-nbu
> machines too!) Once the msiexec (windows installer) is done replacing
> the missing files NBU will function fine and your operations people at
> 2:00AM will continue sleeping as usual, calendar function fully
> restored.
>
> I really am APPALLED at the level of blatant disrespect thrown around on
> this forum between Xnix and Windows admins. You should be ashamed. As
> both an SCSA and MCSE who supports everthing from Windows NT and Solaris
> 2.6 to Windows Server 2003 and Redhat 4 I find your attitudes pathetic.
> If you feel the need to make someone miserible, why not go complain to
> your neighbor when his lawn gets over 3" high because I'd prefer this
> forum remain clear for good natured assistance from Netbackup
> Administrators and peers.
>
> -Jonathan "I work with whatever makes you happy" Martin
>
> PS: No I am not going to buy your book.
>
> <<FLAME OFF>>
>
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