Veritas-bu

[Veritas-bu] database policy and several schedules...

2005-06-11 15:44:17
Subject: [Veritas-bu] database policy and several schedules...
From: kim AT hjemmekontor DOT nu (Kim Hennvall)
Date: Sat, 11 Jun 2005 21:44:17 +0200
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Hello,
 
I might have been reading the original question wrong but i think Hampus was
thinking of online\hot backups and not file backups. When doing a
MS-SQL-Backup (ie) it will create a Default-Application-Backup retention,
schedule in the policy. This will not fire the backup from the client but it
will only tell the NB server for how it will store the backup, and when it's
possible to let the client run the backup. A daily, weekly or monthly
schedule is specified calling a BCH file (SQL specific) but this is only
letting the backup run during those hours. You can specify as many schedules
you like but it will still have the retention period of the
Default-Application-Backup "schedule". 
 
What happens is that the NB server fires off the scripts, the client will
then do a "user"-backup and this is logged with the
Default-Application-Backup. Since you only can have 1
Default-Application-Backup in each policy it will use that retention time,
and not the daily, weekly or monthly. 
 
I haven't tested the oracle policy type, but reckon it will be the same as
the SQL policy type. 
 
Hope this clears some of my thoughts on a saturday night :) 
 
regards
Kim Hennvall
 

  _____  

From: Michael F Lavelle [mailto:Michael.F.Lavelle AT abbott DOT com] 
Sent: 11. juni 2005 20:03
To: Hampus Lind
Cc: Dean; Kim Hennvall; veritas-bu AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu;
veritas-bu-admin AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu
Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] database policy and several schedules...



Hello, 
        I believe the discussion so far has taken the wrong track... 

        Each policy may contain several different schedules. 
        All schedules within the policy must use the same File Selections,
Clients, and Attributes (incl Storage Unit, queue Priority, Multiple Data
Stream toggle, etc...). 

!        However, each schedule has an independent Schedule Type (Calendar
or Freq.), Retention Period, Media Multiplexing, # of Copies, and, yes, you
can over-ride the Storage Unit on a per-schedule basis.        ! 

        You can also exclude File Selections with a schedule specific
exclude_list.<Policy>.<Schedule>.  However, it's a bear to maintain.  One
could attempt this in order to have one policy per client.  It's one way of
doing things, but at the opposite end of the spectrum of where my
environment is at. 

        As an example, there is a turnkey application running in our
environment with an Oracle v8 runtime embedded beneath the application.
There is (apparently) no known method to get a hot backup of the application
data with the Oracle data (RMAN to disk?), so we have been asked to run cold
backups 365 days of the year. 
        We have 3 schedules: 
                full-daily:        Frequency (Sun-Fri - 16 hours), retained
for 21 days 
                full:                Calendar (Recur WeekDay - 2/3/4/Last
Saturday), retained for 2 months 
                full-month:        Calendar (Recur WeekDay - 1st Saturday),
retained for 7 months 

        The 7 month retention is local site custom (Host Properties ->
Master Server -> Properties -> Retention Periods). 
        Remember, if the full-month uses 6 month retention, how old is the
oldest backup in the catalog at 6 months + 2 days from one particular
full-month?  It's the next most recent full-month and it's 5 months and 2
days old.  If your customer has been told backups are retained for 6 months,
you better make sure you can live up to that and all other assurances you
have given. 



Michael F. Lavelle                               Abbott Labs, 
Sr. Storage Engineer, CIT                   100 Abbott Park Rd,  AP14B-1
Phone: 847.937.1195 (Fx:935.9725)   Abbott Park  IL  60064-6042





        "Hampus Lind" <hampus.lind AT rps.police DOT se> 
Sent by: veritas-bu-admin AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu 


06/11/2005 08:02 AM 


        
        To:        "Kim Hennvall" <kim AT hjemmekontor DOT nu>, "Dean"
<dean.deano AT gmail DOT com> 
        cc:        <veritas-bu AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu> 
        Subject:        Re: [Veritas-bu] database policy and several
schedules...



Hi! 
  
Yeah, thats the way we do it here as well, i just want to check if there had
been some changes to this one lately.. To bad it hasent.. 
  
Thanks anyway! 
  
Best regards, 
  
MVH / Hampus Lind
Rikspolisstyrelsen
National Police Board
Tele arb: +46 (0)8 - 401 99 43
Tele mob: +46 (0)70 - 217 92 66
E-mail:  <mailto:hampus.lind AT rps.police DOT se> hampus.lind AT rps.police 
DOT se 
  
  
----- Original Message ----- 
From:  <mailto:kim AT hjemmekontor DOT nu> Kim Hennvall 
To:  <mailto:hampus.lind AT rps.police DOT se> 'Hampus Lind' 
Sent: Saturday, June 11, 2005 11:31 AM 
Subject: RE: [Veritas-bu] database policy and several schedules... 

Hi Hampus. 
  
You will have to have different policies for each retention category. This
was atleast the only way with versions up to 5.1, and i don't think they
have changed it with MPs. I have created 2 policies for this daily_full (1
month retention), and monthly_full (12 months retention) to come around this
one. It's the default- application-backup that controls this one. 
  
best regards 
Kim Hennvall 


  _____  

From: veritas-bu-admin AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu
[mailto:veritas-bu-admin AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu] On Behalf Of Hampus Lind
Sent: 10. juni 2005 21:33
To: veritas-bu AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu
Cc: Fredrik Dahlberg
Subject: [Veritas-bu] database policy and several schedules...

Hi all! 
  
Is there any smart way to have several schedules with different retention
(i.e incr_daily, full_weekly, full_monthly) within the same policy?? Or do
we need to seperate all these schedules to different policies still?? 
  
Best regards, 
  
MVH / Hampus Lind
Rikspolisstyrelsen
National Police Board
Tele arb: +46 (0)8 - 401 99 43
Tele mob: +46 (0)70 - 217 92 66
E-mail:  <mailto:hampus.lind AT rps.police DOT se> hampus.lind AT rps.police 
DOT se 
  
  



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<BODY>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D780312819-11062005>Hello,</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D780312819-11062005></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D780312819-11062005>I might have been reading the original =
question wrong=20
but i think Hampus was thinking of online\hot backups and not file =
backups. When=20
doing a MS-SQL-Backup (ie) it will create a Default-Application-Backup=20
retention, schedule in the policy. This will not fire the backup from =
the client=20
but it will only tell the&nbsp;NB server for&nbsp;how it will store the =
backup,=20
and when it's possible to let the client&nbsp;run the backup.&nbsp;A =
daily,=20
weekly or monthly schedule is specified calling a BCH file (SQL =
specific) but=20
this is only letting the backup run during those hours. You can specify =
as many=20
schedules you like but it will still have the retention period of the=20
Default-Application-Backup "schedule". </SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D780312819-11062005></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D780312819-11062005>What happens is that the NB server fires off =
the=20
scripts, the client will then do a "user"-backup and this is logged with =
the=20
Default-Application-Backup. Since you only can have 1 =
Default-Application-Backup=20
in each policy it will use that retention time, and not the daily, =
weekly or=20
monthly. </SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D780312819-11062005></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D780312819-11062005>I haven't tested the oracle policy type, but =
reckon it=20
will be the same as the SQL policy type. </SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D780312819-11062005></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D780312819-11062005>Hope this clears some of my thoughts on a =
saturday=20
night :) </SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D780312819-11062005></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D780312819-11062005>regards</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D780312819-11062005>Kim Hennvall</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D780312819-11062005></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV><BR>
<DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader lang=3Den-us dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft>
<HR tabIndex=3D-1>
<FONT face=3DTahoma size=3D2><B>From:</B> Michael F Lavelle=20
[mailto:Michael.F.Lavelle AT abbott DOT com] <BR><B>Sent:</B> 11. juni 2005=20
20:03<BR><B>To:</B> Hampus Lind<BR><B>Cc:</B> Dean; Kim Hennvall;=20
veritas-bu AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu;=20
veritas-bu-admin AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: =
[Veritas-bu]=20
database policy and several schedules...<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
<DIV></DIV><BR><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Hello,</FONT> <BR><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I believe the discussion so far has =
taken the=20
wrong track...</FONT> <BR><BR><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp; &nbsp; =
&nbsp;=20
&nbsp; Each policy may contain several different schedules.</FONT> =
<BR><FONT=20
face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; All schedules within =
the policy=20
must use the same File Selections, Clients, and Attributes (incl Storage =
Unit,=20
queue Priority, Multiple Data Stream toggle, etc...).</FONT> =
<BR><BR><FONT=20
face=3DArial size=3D2>! &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;<B>However, each =
schedule has an=20
independent Schedule Type (Calendar or Freq.), Retention Period, Media=20
Multiplexing, # of Copies, and, yes, you can over-ride the Storage Unit =
on a=20
per-schedule basis. &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;!</B></FONT> =
<BR><BR><FONT=20
face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; You can also exclude =
File=20
Selections with a schedule specific=20
exclude_list.&lt;Policy&gt;.&lt;Schedule&gt;. &nbsp;However, it's a bear =
to=20
maintain. &nbsp;One could attempt this in order to have one policy per =
client.=20
&nbsp;It's one way of doing things, but at the opposite end of the =
spectrum of=20
where my environment is at.</FONT> <BR><BR><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2>&nbsp; &nbsp;=20
&nbsp; &nbsp; As an example, there is a turnkey application running in =
our=20
environment with an Oracle v8 runtime embedded beneath the application.=20
&nbsp;There is (apparently) no known method to get a hot backup of the=20
application data with the Oracle data (RMAN to disk?), so we have been =
asked to=20
run cold backups 365 days of the year.</FONT> <BR><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2>&nbsp;=20
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; We have 3 schedules:</FONT> <BR><FONT =
size=3D2><TT>&nbsp;=20
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; full-daily: &nbsp; =
&nbsp;=20
&nbsp; &nbsp;Frequency (Sun-Fri - 16 hours), retained for 21 =
days</TT></FONT>=20
<BR><FONT size=3D2><TT>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; =
&nbsp;=20
full: &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;Calendar =
(Recur=20
WeekDay - 2/3/4/Last Saturday), retained for 2 months</TT></FONT> =
<BR><FONT=20
size=3D2><TT>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; =
full-month:=20
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;Calendar (Recur WeekDay - 1st Saturday), =
retained for=20
7 months</TT></FONT> <BR><BR><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp; &nbsp; =
&nbsp; &nbsp;=20
The 7 month retention is local site custom (Host Properties -&gt; Master =
Server=20
-&gt; Properties -&gt; Retention Periods).</FONT> <BR><FONT face=3DArial =

size=3D2>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Remember, if the full-month uses 6 =
month=20
retention, how old is the oldest backup in the catalog at 6 months + 2 =
days from=20
one particular full-month? &nbsp;It's the next most recent full-month =
and it's 5=20
months and 2 days old. &nbsp;If your customer has been told backups are =
retained=20
for 6 months, you better make sure you can live up to that and all other =

assurances you have given.</FONT> <BR><BR><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2><BR><BR>Michael F. Lavelle &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; =
&nbsp;=20
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Abbott =
Labs,=20
<BR>Sr. Storage Engineer, CIT &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; =
&nbsp;=20
&nbsp; &nbsp; 100 Abbott Park Rd, &nbsp;AP14B-1<BR>Phone: 847.937.1195=20
(Fx:935.9725) &nbsp; Abbott Park &nbsp;IL=20
&nbsp;60064-6042<BR><BR></FONT><BR><BR><BR>
<TABLE width=3D"100%">
  <TBODY>
  <TR vAlign=3Dtop>
    <TD>
    <TD><FONT face=3Dsans-serif size=3D1><B>"Hampus Lind"=20
      &lt;hampus.lind AT rps.police DOT se&gt;</B></FONT> <BR><FONT =
face=3Dsans-serif=20
      size=3D1>Sent by: veritas-bu-admin AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu</FONT>=20
      <P><FONT face=3Dsans-serif size=3D1>06/11/2005 08:02 AM</FONT> =
<BR></P>
    <TD><FONT face=3DArial size=3D1>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; =
</FONT><BR><FONT=20
      face=3Dsans-serif size=3D1>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; To: &nbsp; =
&nbsp;=20
      &nbsp; &nbsp;"Kim Hennvall" &lt;kim AT hjemmekontor DOT nu&gt;, "Dean"=20
      &lt;dean.deano AT gmail DOT com&gt;</FONT> <BR><FONT face=3Dsans-serif=20
      size=3D1>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; cc: &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;=20
      &nbsp;&lt;veritas-bu AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu&gt;</FONT> <BR><FONT=20
      face=3Dsans-serif size=3D1>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Subject: =
&nbsp; &nbsp;=20
      &nbsp; &nbsp;Re: [Veritas-bu] database policy and several=20
      schedules...</FONT></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR><BR><BR><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
size=3D2>Hi!</FONT> <BR><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" =
size=3D3>&nbsp;</FONT>=20
<BR><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Yeah, thats the way we do it here as =
well, i just=20
want to check if there had been some changes to this one lately.. To bad =
it=20
hasent..</FONT> <BR><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" =
size=3D3>&nbsp;</FONT> <BR><FONT=20
face=3DArial size=3D2>Thanks anyway!</FONT> <BR><FONT face=3D"Times New =
Roman"=20
size=3D3>&nbsp;</FONT> <BR><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Best =
regards,</FONT> <BR><FONT=20
face=3D"Times New Roman" size=3D3>&nbsp;</FONT> <BR><FONT face=3D"Times =
New Roman"=20
size=3D3>MVH / Hampus Lind<BR>Rikspolisstyrelsen<BR>National Police =
Board<BR>Tele=20
arb: +46 (0)8 - 401 99 43<BR>Tele mob: +46 (0)70 - 217 92 66<BR>E-mail:=20
</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:hampus.lind AT rps.police DOT se"><FONT face=3D"Times =
New Roman"=20
color=3Dblue size=3D3><U>hampus.lind AT rps.police DOT se</U></FONT></A> =
<BR><FONT=20
face=3D"Times New Roman" size=3D3>&nbsp;</FONT> <BR><FONT face=3D"Times =
New Roman"=20
size=3D3>&nbsp;</FONT> <BR><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" size=3D3>----- =
Original=20
Message ----- </FONT><BR><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" =
size=3D3><B>From:</B>=20
</FONT><A href=3D"mailto:kim AT hjemmekontor DOT nu"><FONT face=3D"Times New =
Roman"=20
color=3Dblue size=3D3><U>Kim Hennvall</U></FONT></A><FONT face=3D"Times =
New Roman"=20
size=3D3> </FONT><BR><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" size=3D3><B>To:</B> =
</FONT><A=20
href=3D"mailto:hampus.lind AT rps.police DOT se"><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" 
=
color=3Dblue=20
size=3D3><U>'Hampus Lind'</U></FONT></A><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" =
size=3D3>=20
</FONT><BR><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" size=3D3><B>Sent:</B> =
Saturday, June 11,=20
2005 11:31 AM</FONT> <BR><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" =
size=3D3><B>Subject:</B> RE:=20
[Veritas-bu] database policy and several schedules...</FONT> =
<BR><BR><FONT=20
face=3DArial color=3Dblue size=3D2>Hi Hampus.</FONT> <BR><FONT =
face=3D"Times New Roman"=20
size=3D3>&nbsp;</FONT> <BR><FONT face=3DArial color=3Dblue size=3D2>You =
will have to=20
have different policies for each retention category. This was atleast =
the only=20
way with versions up to 5.1, and i don't think they have changed it with =
MPs. I=20
have created 2 policies for this daily_full (1 month retention), and=20
monthly_full (12 months retention) to come around this one. It's the =
default-=20
application-backup that controls this one.</FONT> <BR><FONT=20
face=3D"Times New Roman" size=3D3>&nbsp;</FONT> <BR><FONT face=3DArial =
color=3Dblue=20
size=3D2>best regards</FONT> <BR><FONT face=3DArial color=3Dblue =
size=3D2>Kim=20
Hennvall</FONT> <BR><BR>
<HR>
<FONT face=3DTahoma size=3D2><B>From:</B> =
veritas-bu-admin AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu=20
[mailto:veritas-bu-admin AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu] <B>On Behalf Of =
</B>Hampus=20
Lind<B><BR>Sent:</B> 10. juni 2005 21:33<B><BR>To:</B>=20
veritas-bu AT mailman.eng.auburn DOT edu<B><BR>Cc:</B> Fredrik=20
Dahlberg<B><BR>Subject:</B> [Veritas-bu] database policy and several=20
schedules...</FONT><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" =
size=3D3><BR></FONT><BR><FONT=20
face=3DArial size=3D2>Hi all!</FONT> <BR><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman"=20
size=3D3>&nbsp;</FONT> <BR><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Is there any =
smart way to have=20
several schedules with different retention (i.e incr_daily, full_weekly, =

full_monthly) within the same policy?? Or do we need to seperate all =
these=20
schedules to different policies still??</FONT> <BR><FONT face=3D"Times =
New Roman"=20
size=3D3>&nbsp;</FONT> <BR><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Best =
regards,</FONT> <BR><FONT=20
face=3D"Times New Roman" size=3D3>&nbsp;</FONT> <BR><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2>MVH /=20
Hampus Lind<BR>Rikspolisstyrelsen<BR>National Police Board<BR>Tele arb: =
+46 (0)8=20
- 401 99 43<BR>Tele mob: +46 (0)70 - 217 92 66<BR>E-mail: </FONT><A=20
href=3D"mailto:hampus.lind AT rps.police DOT se"><FONT face=3DArial =
color=3Dblue=20
size=3D2><U>hampus.lind AT rps.police DOT se</U></FONT></A> <BR><FONT=20
face=3D"Times New Roman" size=3D3>&nbsp;</FONT> <BR><FONT face=3D"Times =
New Roman"=20
size=3D3>&nbsp;</FONT> <BR><BR></BODY></HTML>

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