Same experience here -

Buying a "cheap" library is like knowing you've accepted the "low bidder"
for brain surgery ;>)

We've been through exactly the same analysis, same strategy, same arguments,
and fortunately have always had the same results - more cost effective in
the long run to buy the big library up front.

(BTW, in addition to the capital $$, remember that YOUR TIME for managing
multiple libraries and changing libraries in and out is worth a LOT.)

BUT, if you add another 3583, with LTO2, and upgrade your existing 3583 to
LTO2 -
KNOWING that in a couple of years you should be able to go to LTO3 - would
that do it?

A BIG advantage of the LTOx media is that the standard calls for
write-compatibility for 1 generation back and read compatibility for 2
generations back.

If you're growing so fast that 2 3583's with LTO2 won't hold your data for 3
years -
I think you're gonna end up with a frame-based system anyway!

Condolences,

Wanda







-----Original Message-----
From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:ADSM-L AT VM.MARIST DOT EDU] On Behalf Of 
Ben
Bullock
Sent: Tuesday, June 15, 2004 2:50 PM
To: ADSM-L AT VM.MARIST DOT EDU
Subject: Re: Tier'ed library


        Your posting caught my eye with 6 years and 10 different
libraries.

        We have been on TSM(adsm) for almost 8 years now. When the
system was first speced out, they did some cost analysis and decided
that the 3494 tape library with the 3590 tape drives were the best
solution for the long-term. As you know that is a frame system and it is
NOT CHEAP.

        There was a lot of weeping, wailing and gnashing of teeth, with
folk's wanting cheaper solutions up front. The evaluation group kept to
their guns and the library was bought. Well, we are now 8 years down the
road and the libraries are still in use. They are the oldest things in
the computer rooms, long depreciated off the books, but still working
like a champ. We've extended on and on and on as the storage in the
environment has exploded with very little re-work or downtime. Yes we
had to upgrade the 3590 drives to the various iterations of capacity,
but the library is still the same.

        I feel it was a wise investment that is still paying dividends
today.

        We have some remote sites which went cheap on some DLTs at the
same time and they are once again looking at their 3rd iteration of tape
libraries. They once again want to go cheap, but we are pressing them to
get a 3584 with LTO2 tapes so they can install it once and then expand
it.

        Just my 2 cents.

Ben


-----Original Message-----
From: ADSM: Dist Stor Manager [mailto:ADSM-L AT VM.MARIST DOT EDU] On Behalf Of
Tab Trepagnier
Sent: Tuesday, June 15, 2004 12:23 PM
To: ADSM-L AT VM.MARIST DOT EDU
Subject: Tier'ed library


TSM Server 5.1.9.0 on AIX 5.2 ML-2
TSM Server 5.2 media on hand

We have outgrown our 3583 and 3575s, so I'm looking for a new tape
library.  At first I though my only choices were another standalone
library like the 3583 or go with a frame system like the 3584.  I have
problems with both approaches.

The standalone library, while cheaper, means that in 2-3 years I will
have filled up yet  another library now destined to collect dust in a
corner. Since ADSM 2 six years ago we have use 10 different libraries or
autoloaders on our system.  Five of them are still in service.  That is
ridiculous.

The frame system is just too expensive for our little company.  We've
obtained quotes for four and six drive configurations using LVDS and FC,
and the price range is $125K - $180K.  That's a LOT of money to us.

So I'm thinking that a standalone library that can be expanded in tiers
would be an effective way to "split the difference."  Start smaller with
one tier, and simply add a tier once we've outgrown it.

I'm thinking four LTO-2 drives using LVDS connectivity to start.
Initial
*real* capacity should be about 10 TB.  It should accept at least two
additional tiers before maxing out.  It must be supported by some
variant of TSM 5.x.

What has been the experience of forum users with libraries of that type?
Do you have any brand/model recommendations?  Models to avoid?

Thanks in advance.

Tab Trepagnier
TSM Administrator
Laitram, L.L.C.